Please read the full transcript below as you listen to the audio...

Present: George Woods, Betty Greene, Leslie Flint.

Communicators: Alfred Frost, Mickey.

George Woods:

Yes? George Woods...

Alfred Frost:

...and Betty Greene.

Betty Greene:

That's right.

Woods:

That's right.

Greene:

That's right.

Frost:

George Woods and Betty Greene.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

Oh, I know all about you two.

Greene:

Have you?

Frost:

Ha, I should do.

Flint: [Laughing]

Huh!

Frost:

[I've been coming] to these meetings...

Greene:

Yes?

Frost:

...from time to time and keeping an eye on you, see what you're up to.

Greene: [Laughing]

Woods:

Oh yes?

Frost:

Yes. You're very, very busy and interested in all that goes on, in one way and another, aren't you?

[microphone interference]

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

My goodness me.

You don't know much about it though.

Flint: [Laughing]

Huh!

Greene:

We don't know much about it?

You're quite right, we probably don't.

Frost:

Oh, you have no idea what goes on here behind the scenes, one way and another. Cor! Stone me, I don't know. The paraphernalia and umpteen things going on all at the same time. It's amazing anyone can speak at all.

Greene:

I wish we did know, it would be interesting.

Frost:

Ah... Frost.

Greene:

Your name is Frost?

Frost:

My name is Alfred Frost.

Greene:

Alfred Frost.

Frost:

That's right. Alfred...

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

...is my name.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

You're Betty.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

You're George.

Greene:

That's right.

Frost:

I feel as if I've known you for years.

Greene:

Really?

Frost:

In a kind of way I have, but not as long as all that.

Greene:

No?

Frost:

I've been coming several times lately and watching the way things are done, promising myself an opportunity to have a few words with you and let you know a few 'tips', you know.

Greene:

Yes?

Can you give us a talk Mr Frost?

Frost:

Oh, I don't know about giving a talk...

Woods:

What are you doing on that side of life Mr Frost?

Flint: [sound of breathing]

Woods:

Is he any relation to that Frost...

Greene:

I wonder if he's any relation...

Woods:

...to the Mr Frost that we went to last week?

Greene:

It's funny that.

Woods:

Yes.

Flint: [Sniffing]

Frost:

I'm very active.

Greene:

Mmm?

Woods:

Very active?

Frost:

I'm very active, I am.

Greene:

Yes?

Frost:

I go all over the place. Whenever I feel inclined. Not that one can do very much. When you want to try and help someone of course you do what you can, but it's not always possible. You can't force anyone to say or do anything if they don't want to do it. You can try and impress them as best you can...

Greene:

Yes?

Frost:

...but most people they, I don't know, are so caught up in their own daily lives and their ideas. Very few people know of this and when they do know, I don't think it makes all that much difference to a lot of them.

You would have thought by now [that] everyone would have understood, to some extent, about life after death... and people have got these weird ideas. Even the so-called religious people seem, to me, are no wiser or better off. They've got some funny ideas.

Greene:

Did you know about it Mr Frost?

Frost:

No, not really. Well, like a lot more people I'd heard about it, but I never went into it and I thought it's probably a lot of nonsense anyway.

Greene:

And how did it affect...

Frost:

I remember, donkey's years ago, in some Sunday paper I think it was or some paper, there was a whole series of articles about... some clergyman had written about life after death...

Greene:

Oh yes...

Frost:

Someone called Owen*, I think his name was.

​

*Reverend George Vale Owen

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

Peculiar name he had. I didn't know whether to take it in or not and I thought, well, you would think a man like that should know and he wouldn't fool anyone, but it all seemed so odd to me. But I wasn't terribly interested really. I was... I was interested in the articles, but I didn't really know whether to believe it or not. I didn't really make much head nor tail of it.

Do you know Hatfield?

Greene:

Hatfield?

Frost:

I used to live in Hatfield.

Greene:

Oh yes.

Frost:

Mmm...

Woods:

Oh yes.

Frost:

A number of years I lived there and Harpenden.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

I moved about a little bit in my earlier years. I went to sea when I was a lad.

Greene:

Yes?

Frost:

Yeah. Oh, that's many years ago now. Things have changed. The world's changed.

Greene:

Mr Frost, um, how... when you did pass over how did you, uh... how were you affected. I mean...

Frost:

Oh, I don't know. I was out in the garden, doing some... a bit of gardening and feeling 'as right as rain' I was. Pleasant, happy day it was. I always liked to get out into the garden and do a little bit, you know.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

All I remember was feeling a bit giddy and that was it. I remember my daughter, she came out to the garden to call me for a cup of tea and she saw me lying on the path there. Of course, by that time I was gone, you see.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

I could see her. I stood there and it dawned on me almost immediately what had happened and... I have been told since that sometimes people don't realise they're dead, but I knew almost, well, instinctively, or whatever it is.

I could see myself lying down on the path and I saw my daughter come out and she saw me lying there and she let out a yell. She dropped the cup and saucer and ran down... and, of course, by that time I was gone, you see.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

But oh, there was a set to*. Of course, I was living with my daughter you see, my married daughter. My wife had passed over some years ago and I remember only too well, uh, just after my daughter found me, my wife appeared to me and she was all-smiling, like a young girl she looked.

*a set to = a period of difficulty

At first I didn't even recognise her. That was the funny part about it. And, I suppose it's... of course, in my own mind I had always thought of her as an old lady, you see. It took me quite a few, I suppose, minutes of time – I don't know how long it might have been – before I gathered my wits and realised who it was.

Oh, it was 'a do' that day, I tell you. Of course they came and carried me inside and... oh, dear. And my...my son-in-law, he was there. Actually, he'd been out you see, and my daughter was all on her own. He was out somewhere. I think he'd gone to a match or something, if I remember right.

Of course, there was a proper 'to do' and then they took me away and...

*a do /to do = difficult situation

Oh, of course, then there was a funeral and... I always remember my daughter coming out into the garden and she picked some roses and she put them on my coffin.

Greene:

Oh yes?

Frost:

Of course, this is going back a number of years now. Before the war, this was.

Greene:

Yes?

Frost:

You know. I was, I don't know, sort of, all mixed up inside. I tried, of course, in my own way to let her know I was there but she didn't understand. Nobody does, you know. That's the trouble. I think that's the worst part of dying, if you ask me.

It's the fact that the people you love... and you try to contact them, you try to tell them you're alright, try to cheer them up - and you're feeling so marvellous yourself and there's all the people you love, all upset, and you're dying to get to them, you might say, and cheer them up and make them know what's what [and] nobody takes any notice.

It's a terrible thing. I think the worst part of dying, for the people who have died, from what I can see of it, is the state of the people left behind who don't know a thing. In spite of all the religion, they don't know anything. They don't teach anything, they don't prove anything. That's why, in a way, the Spiritualists are the only bunch that try to do something.

And there again, of course, a lot of the mediums that... well, for the first few months I went to various churches or places, as you call them, where they meet, you know. But I didn't have much success and I was hoping I might have got some sort of message over, but... Oh, that's frustrating if you like, that is.

Greene:

Mmm...

Frost:

Although, there again, one shouldn't say it. One should be grateful for the fact there are people who do know something and do try and, of course, there are good mediums.

I've been coming here for the past few weeks getting an eyeful, trying to get my, sort of... get my... myself sort of, sorted out a bit, in the hope of, you know, being of some help.

Greene:

You're doing very well.

Frost:

But I must say, it's all very interesting, at the same time it's still a bit odd, speaking. Isn't it?

Greene:

Mr Frost, What did you do after the funeral? Did your wife take you off somewhere or...?

Frost:

Oh bli... Oh, dear... Yes, well, once the funeral was over and... there didn't seem anything to hold onto, I mean, there was no more body there, you know and...

Besides, not that I was that interested in the body. But I suppose, to some extent, while I was still, in a strange kind of way, linked with the body – well, perhaps not that so much – I think I was more... I was, sort of, linked with my daughter and the rest of the people, you know, family.

Not that I... I'd only got my daughter really left, of course, and she'd got no children and she always was a good girl and I wanted to cheer her up, that was my main interest. But of course it was useless, and my son-in-law was quite a decent fellow, but... well, I thought there was no point in staying, hanging around.

Anyway, we... my wife and me... and I met a lot of other people, of course, and I decided to get out of... out of the way. There was no point in hanging about.

Then my wife taught me... brought me – I say she brought me, well I suppose in a kind of way she did – but anyway, she seemed the one that was most responsible, uh... but there were a lot of other people, of course, helping. And then we came together here and now we're very happy and...

I live in I suppose you would call it a... well, it sounds stupid to say 'a block of flats'...

Greene:

No.

Frost:

...because it's not a block of flats really, in a way, but there is vast places, you know. I suppose you could call them a kind of communal centre...

Greene:

Mmm...

Frost:

...where hundreds and hundreds of people live. But everyone is so much in harmony, you see, that it doesn't matter. In fact, a lot of of us prefer it.

There are people who have their own little places and prefer it that way, I suppose, but I'm quite happy. I always was a good mixer, I always got on well with people and I was never the argumentative sort, but then of course, over here, there is no need for that.

We are all so much in tune and it's wonderful how we get together and there are all sorts of things one can do. And I'm still very fond of the garden, and there's a beautiful...well, actually, it's like as if it's built, not in a square exactly, but in the centre there's a vast expanse of beautiful ground and flowers.

There's fountains playing and there's even children. These are children that have recently passed over, that have come here, that are being cared for. There's a whole section devoted to children, where they are cared for and where there are, perhaps, no relations or parents, in particular.

Over here the children are looked after by people who love children. My wife was always fond of children and she takes a section of the children. And then there are those who teach. There's big schools here, but they are not schools in the same sense, I suppose, as you understand it.

They have various methods of education. But this is... there again, not a material education, it's a spiritual education, but there are aspects, I suppose, of the material – inasmuch that they are taught about life, as was lived on Earth, and history and implications of self. But it's all very difficult to put into words. I don't think we can, you know.

[There's] wonderful country surroundings and there's lovely flowers everywhere. The children are very happy, playing...

Greene:

Mmm... and you help with the children yourself, do you?

Frost:

No, I don't have a lot to do with the children really myself. Of course, I'm fond of them, but there are experts here, people who specialise, you know.

Greene:

Do you do any special work yourself?

Frost:

Well, I know this must sound stupid to you, but I was always very interested myself in carving.

Greene:

Oh.

Frost:

I would always have liked to have been... well, I was, in a kind of way, a carpenter, but not professional. I always admired beautiful carving and would have liked to have been able to have made, when on Earth, furniture and things like that. So I take a great interest in that and I do carving and I make what... well it is furniture.

You see, that's another thing, I should imagine, a lot of people just don't appreciate or realise that things are real and solid to us, just as everything is in your world. And we have substances that grow, substances that we can use and these things are solid and we can use those things. We can have tools for creating and helping to create things – carving in my case, you see.

And it's something that gives me great pleasure. Some people seem to think that, over here, all you do is think and there it is. Well that's just plain stupid. I know that in a strange kind of way this can happen under certain conditions, but once people think like that I think it gives them a false idea.

I think people should get the realisation that this is a real world. Actually, of course in a way, it's a world among many worlds, on different levels...

Greene:

Mmm...

Frost:

And that on each level of consciousness and life, that world for you is a reality and a solid one. And there are substances, all manner of substances, which are used and can be used for construction.

There are people who love to design and build. There are people who are quite happy using their hands and I love to use mine, in creating what I feel is something of benefit, something of beauty and I can use my own personality in it, you see, and express myself.

If people think that all you do is just think and there it is, they've got a shock coming.

Greene:

Yes!

Frost:

Because believe me they will be living for a short space of time in a purely mental world which has no foundation. A lot of people are going to be very disappointed I think, if... um, they think all they want is going to be automatically here waiting for them. They'll find you have to work for it just the same.

You have to do your share. It isn't just there because you want it, it's there because you've made it possible.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

It's quite a different thing, you know.

Greene:

Oh yes, I understand that.

Frost:

Of course, I suppose people in your world, even the so-called Spiritualists, there's a lot of wishful thinking on their part, you know.

Greene:

I'm afraid so.

Woods:

Have you been in any... any higher planes of order, at all?

Frost:

No. And... I wouldn't say it's just because I'm content, although it's perfectly true to say I am content, I don't feel any particular urge to 'go any further', as you call it, and I don't suppose I shall, until such time as I've made it possible even, perhaps, almost an unconscious way.

I think it's the truth, you know, to say that we progress so slowly that, uh, we are not altogether aware or conscious of that change, it's so... too subtle. It's as if you go on for what, I suppose, would be a long time to you.

I don't know, but years not being what they are with us as they are with you, but this business of people that come and talk in a highfalutin* way and how highly progressed they are...

​

*highfalutin = self-important, pretentious

I'm not suggesting that there's not truth in that; there are very great souls, highly progressed of course, who have been here for centuries upon centuries and you would expect them to progress anyway.

But the average person, like myself, who has only been here a few years, we are in a condition or an environment which is best suited to us, in which we, uh, are happy because it is obviously the right place for us to be. It's not some super-duper* kind of place, all very highfalutin and far removed. It's a world which, in many senses, is very like the Earth.

​

*super-duper = very impressive

We have many of the things that you associate with Earth; that is, things that are essential or necessary or things that are natural. Of course we don't need machinery, as such. That's another thing, if a person creates, whether it's like me with my carving or in some other way, you don't have machines. You don't have factories.

This is an individual thing, something part of oneself, an expressing of oneself, and it's as real to us as your things are to you, but this is individual, this is not business. We don't have big business. We don't have factories, machinery. We don't have buses and trams and trains. Those things are purely material, of your world. But we have methods of getting about.

But, there again, this is something which is from within ourselves, uh, when we understand ourselves a little better so we lighten, as it were, ourselves, in a conscious kind of way. And that which would have seemed, perhaps, difficult or heavy going is simplified and there is no effort.

You see, everything is within yourself. When people can understand that everything is within yourself – as to what you are and what you will do and what you will become – then things become a little bit more understandable and more rational.

But of course there are, its true to say, there are people who, because of the state of their mind, they are in an environment not so very far removed from Earth, because they are holding themselves down by these material thoughts. And they do have many things that you associate with Earth, but these are merely figments, you might say, of their own thoughts and imagination.

And since thought is creative, moreso here than even on your side, you can have a kind of... well, a state of being, if you like, in which you seem to be living, which really is a dream state, of a kind. In fact, it's not really an awakening to spirit at all, it's really a condition of life which you have accustomed yourself to by your thoughts, made possible by your thoughts.

But this is a transitional stage. This is, I suppose, what the Catholics call, uh, Purgatory or something or limbo, or whatever you like. It's a sort of intermediary stage which can and does exist for some people. Indeed, I would say that in some cases this is necessary. It probably must be.

Greene:

Mmm...

Frost:

But this is not a reality, this is a merging of your world consciousness. It's a sort of dreamlike quality, state of being, which, uh, affects certain types of individuals who have been so materialistic in their outlook, that they can't help themselves. They are not ready yet. And other souls from higher spheres have to come and do a lot of work to get them out of that condition which they have found themselves – really, which they have created for themselves.

You see, if only you could see around your world. It's as if there are varying degrees of life, some inter...interwoven or entwined with your world, where there is a weird mixture of living in almost, you might say, two worlds in one. That's where you get your hauntings from...

Greene:

Yes...

Frost:

That's where you get these souls who are close... so close to earth in their mentality, that at certain times, under certain conditions, they become visible to people on your side who are probably not Spiritualistic or anything like that at all, but who do see.

There are moments of time when it is feasible, under certain conditions, for certain souls, Earthbound souls, to become quite physical or visible. Indeed, if only people realised it, the power of the mind is such that anything is possible. Nothing is impossible to those who understand a little bit more.

I'm beginning to realise more and more that there are tremendous things which could be done and achieved and even by people in your world, if only they would be cooperative and turn their minds a little bit towards spirit. You see, that's the tragedy. The world has become more and more materialistic and less and less interested in things of the spirit and the mind you know.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:
The tragedies of your world are what man has created by wrong thinking. I mean, look at this terrible business the other week of that young man that...

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

...who killed like that*. It's the state of mind of the people that has brought it about, that the conditions around that country are appalling. It's like a pool of, well...

*the assassination of Robert F. Kennedy?

Anyway, as a matter of fact, we know this and I'm going to tell you, as in the nature of a prophecy, there are going to be some pretty terrible things happening there before very long and it's going to be almost like a revolt. I think that there's going to be so much going on that, well... I think there's going to be such upheavals in that country. It's terrible to think about. Of course, the innocent will be the ones who will suffer most.

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

Always is the way of course, isn't it?

Greene:

Yes.

Frost:

Oh yes, the world is in a shocking state. I'm jolly glad to be out of it.

Greene:

I expect you are!

Frost:

I must come and speak to you again...

Greene:

It's very nice of you Mr Frost.

Frost:

Anyway, it's nice to speak to Mr George Woods and Miss Betty Greene.

Woods:

Thank you.

Greene:

Thank you Mr Frost.

Woods:

Thank you so much for coming through.

Frost:

Perhaps I can come another day.

Greene:

Thank you.

Woods:

Thank you.

Frost:

I wish you well.

Greene:

Thank you Mr Frost.

Frost:

Well, goodbye.

Woods:

Thank you very much.

Greene:

Goodbye. Bye-bye.

Mickey:

Bye-bye.

Greene:

Thank you Mickey.

Greene:

Thank you Mickey so much...

Flint:

Bye-bye.

END OF RECORDING

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This transcript was created from the audio by K.Jackson-Barnes on December 4th 2021.

The audio recording was originally digitised on December 16th 2004
by Flint Trust volunteer Jack Terrence Andrews.

​

The transcript and text on this page is the intellectual property of K.Jackson-Barnes and must not be copied or republished without permission.