The Leslie Flint Educational Trust

Please read the full transcript below as you listen...

Flint:
This séance was recorded on the 4th of August – July...August !

Eira:
No, it is August.

Flint:
It is August, yes.

Eira:
[Laughing] You wouldn't think so would you?

Flint:
1965. Medium Leslie Flint.

Mickey:
...we do our best.

Eira:
Yes. You always do.

Douglas:
[Whispering] Hello my dear.

Eira:
Hello darling. How soon you've come through. How nice.

Douglas:
I've been looking forward so much to this.

Eira:
Have you really? Lovely.

Douglas:
Yes.

Eira:
So have I.

Douglas:
You heard any more about the book?

Eira:
Oh no, it isn't out at the moment. It's being revised. It's going out again in a months time, I hope. I haven't quite got it complete yet.

Douglas:
Oh. Making new...new...making a revision are you?

Eira:
That's it. It's a new typescript and I have to wait for the...

Douglas:
Oh.

Eira:
...parts of it to be done.

[Short silence]

Douglas:
What shall we talk about?

Eira:
Well, do you feel strong enough, darling, to talk about reincarnation? You said that you would like to, once.

Douglas:
Well, I feel strong enough, but I suppose if the medium isn't too well, it's more difficult. It seems so anyway.

Eira:
Oh...

Douglas:
But I'll do my best.

Eira:
Yes, thank you.

Douglas:
I hate...don't like to disappoint you naturally. But I come just as enthusiastically as you do...

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
...looking forward to it tremendously and trying to decide what I should talk about. And I always want to talk about the things you want me to talk about, of course. Reincarnation is such a enormous subject that it would take many sessions.

Eira:
Yes, of course it would.

Douglas:
I think the most important thing to realise in regard to reincarnation is the fact that it is something which isn't necessarily essential, in every instance. In other words, not everyone incarnates again, although many, many do - in fact, the vast majority.

But of course, we have to go back centuries upon centuries of time and realise that there are many, many souls who have incarnated on several occasions and now do not feel the need to incarnate again. But, uh, of course one has to accept the fact that in one life on Earth one can only hope to, in a sense, skim the surface of experience, and it's often necessary to re-enter the Earth-world to live a new life; in a new guise, in a new body, as a new being. Indeed sometimes of the opposite sex. Sometimes it's essential to experience certain happenings which can only be experienced, uh, under certain conditions, which previously were quite different when you were on Earth before.

Eira:
Yes...

Douglas:
Then again I think one should remember that there are individuals who choose to return to do a special work. Most of the great teachers and prophets of old, were very old souls who had chosen to return to do a certain work in a certain age, and set an example and show the path for others who might follow.

Eira:
Yes. So many very...rather important and learned people who don't accept it darling, do they? For instance, our beloved Findlay didn't seem be able to embrace it.

Douglas:
I don't think, in a sense...although it may sound rather odd, I don't think it really matters...

Eira:
No I don't...

Douglas:
...in some cases. There are bound to be people with differing views and different strata of experience. And, of course, there are many people to whom reincarnation is repugnant and who, possibly in many instances, will not have the need to incarnate, will not want to reincarnate.

You see, the point is, that there are so many souls on Earth who have, uh, experienced a great deal in previous lives - of which they of course remember little or nothing at all, more likely than not, nothing at all - and in consequence they do not have the time in their incarnation, to have experience of these things.

But...and in a way it's a good thing. I mean, people always say, 'if one could remember this or that, then it would be very good evidence or proof of it...and since we don't remember, how do we know?' But the point is this, that in many instances, it would be a bad thing to have recognition or remembrance of previous lives, because that would be a barrier rather than a help.

For instance, if you remembered certain aspects of life that were, in your own instance or own case, bad - from the point of view of the fact that you did this or that, that you should not have done, which was detrimental to your spiritual advancement...if you remembered this too vividly and knew about it too much, you would then, in the next incarnation, be on your guard and you would be artificially, you might say, avoiding things.

In other words, when a thing happens, it must happen from within oneself. If you want to do good or if you want to live a life that is good or do certain things that are wise, then these things will spring from within oneself and come naturally.

But if you do things because you think you should do them, it's the right thing to and you do them against your will, or if you do something because you think it's essential that you do it, because in a previous incarnation you neglected that aspect of yourself...in other words, if you do something through a kind of fear, then that's not good in itself.

Eira:
No.

Douglas:
You see, it must spring naturally from one's innermost soul that you want to do something...

Eira:
Yes, that's a very interesting point. I've never felt that really...

Douglas:
People say...so many people say, 'oh well if I knew where I went wrong last time, I could avoid it.' Well, the point is, that if you knew where you went wrong or you knew what your failings were, and in this incarnation you were on your guard and you were saying to yourself, 'now I mustn't do this' or 'I mustn't do that. This is where I went wrong last time', you would probably, almost certainly, be doing something, in a sense, through fear. You wouldn't be doing it naturally, it wouldn't...

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
...be springing from your innermost soul when you wanted to do something. You see, until man learns to live according to his inner conscience and his inner realisation of things that are wise and good, until man desires to do good for good's sake and not through a kind of fear...that is the trouble of course for the majority of religions.

Eira:
Yes, yes.

Douglas:
So much goodness comes, not through the sake of goodness or wanting particularly to be good, but but through the fear of doing otherwise, in case they are...in case one is punished, you see?

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
That is one of the big faults with, uh, orthodox religion.

Eira:
Yes. Have you found...learnt your, um, incarnations darling?

Douglas:
Oh yes I...

Eira:
When did you know about them?

Douglas:
I've known about them for some little time...

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
...but I'm getting to know a little more of the detail. But the point is, that there are some incarnations of which one has little knowledge or realisation, because in themselves they played a very unimportant part.

You see, there are lives in which - I suppose the formative lives or the formative experiences of Earth - which were so basic, which were so...in any case, one has to go back to the time and the way of life of the times and also to realise that one was the product of an age to some extent.

You see, there again, I think it's important to realise that...that people are the product of an age. And what is generally accepted as the thing to do or the outlook of life that one may have in that age, may not necessarily fit in and could not fit in with another age.

You see, there is so much that one has to take into consideration. For instance, a person may not be, according to the age in which they live, as bad a person as perhaps we would think in retrospect. Because they are the product of an age that may have been, for instance, very cruel - and cruelty was an accepted thing.

I mean, this may sound like an excuse, but the point is, that there are things that do not happen in your life today, which were commonplace a hundred years ago.

Eira:
Yes. Yes, of course.

Douglas:
For instance, you take...today you don't hang children, but a hundred years ago it wasn't an unknown thing for children who stole a loaf of bread to be hanged, you see.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
The point is, that we are the product of our age and our time and the thinking. You see, the whole point is, the thought-force of an age is so powerful...

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
...that it affects the whole of life, it affects the whole of humanity and until man progresses en masse...you see, we talk about the individual progress of man which is, of course, necessary and vital and of course it must be the individual progress of man that will formulate the whole thinking of the whole human race en mass.

But the point is, that an age is predominantly as it thinks, and the peoples of that age are the product of the minds of a previous generation...

Eira:
Yes, yes.

Douglas:
...that have been the formation of their own and present. So we are all, in a sense, in an age of change or time of change and in evolution.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
And an age...an individual life in a certain age, is essential and necessary and we learn, to a certain extent, and we make terrible mistakes and we have failure.

But the point is, that it is often necessary for the human being to incarnate; in a new incarnation, in a new life, in a new age - to contribute something which is very necessary, not only to himself (or evolve or develop in himself) but to contribute to the age in which he is reborn.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
There are great instances of course of this, of great souls who, in a way, stand head and shoulders above the peoples of their time. They are great leaders or great teachers or great prophets or great seers or...in some field or other. Maybe it is in art for instance or music.

All these great souls on which, often, the world looks upon as a genius. Or, for instance, if not that, in some instances, they are looked upon as people out of time, people that perhaps are not always accepted in their age, people who do not seem to fit in.

These are old souls who have chosen to return, or perhaps, in some instances, have been sent back. But no one really enters into the world unwillingly. I don't think one can say that anyone is forced back. The point is, that the majority of people desire to enter into the world again. They feel the need for experiences or perhaps they feel the need to do a specific work or job.

Everything is law and order, everything is logical. The extraordinary is that people always say, for instance, about Spiritualism or communication or reincarnation or whatever it may be, to do with the psychic or the spiritual, that it's not logical. Actually, the most logical thing of all is this spiritual realisation. People cling to the material and think that is the logical, but it isn't, it's the most illogical.

Eira:
Yes, I do see that point darling...

Flint:
[Loud coughing]

Douglas:
I'm sorry...

Eira:
Could I just ask if, um, does the subconscious mind retain memory of past lives?

Douglas:
It can do. But unfortunately it's invariably a great effort for the individual to recapture past memories. It's something that, often, one has to - if one is interested of course in this - one has to force oneself, one has to, sort of, endeavour very hard to jog one's memory...

Eira:
Well, I have my wonderful reincarnation graph you know, drawn through Harold Sharp.*

Douglas:
Yes.

Eira:
He could scarcely make up five of my former important...

Douglas:
Well, uh...

Eira:
...giving me absolute dates and details. And I do remember my last one in the seventeenth century, a little.

Douglas:
Yes. Well, there you are you see. I think it is, at times, possible. But, it's not a general thing.

Eira:
No. I see.

Douglas:
But it's possible for some individuals to tap the source of supply or tap the source of knowledge, uh, of these things.

Eira:
Mmm. I seem to have been mediumistic - especially in the seventeenth century. It seems rather interesting, doesn't it?

Douglas:
But then again, you are in this, but you probably don't realise it. That's the trouble.

Eira:
Well, not in the usual sense.

Douglas:
You're not a medium in the accepted sense, but you have tremendous inspiration. Although sometimes you ignore it and possibly think it's imagination.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
A great deal that you could do, you don't do. I don't say it's your fault. But I think it is that you are, to some extent, inclined to be over careful - which is, in a way, not bad thing. But the point is, that you could put down to paper a lot of impressions and thoughts and ideas that I instil in your mind.

Eira:
Yes. Have we been together in former lives?

Flint:
[Loud cough]

Douglas:
Oh, we've had two Egyptian incarnations, one in ancient China...

Eira:
Oh that's an interesting one...

Douglas:
...and one in...one...one, to my knowledge, in ancient Rome. And also we were, to some extent, um, influential in the...in the early eighteenth century - late seventeenth and early eighteenth century - in bringing into being a new realisation of the teachings of Christ. But, um, this of course was very difficult for us - it was an age where orthodoxy was very powerful.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
But we did, um, have an interpretation and a realisation of the Christian faith, which, um, we tried to instil and impress and bring into being, but it was, of course, very difficult. Of course, you know one time we had a link with Holland?

Eira:
Yes, of course...I think that was the seventeenth century one, where I was, uh...to save my head I seemed to have embraced the Roman Church, which amuses me. Ha!

Douglas:
Yes. Well there you are, you see. It was in this age that we had this, sort of, realisation of true Christian faith. But there were circumstances which became very difficult. And, uh, if we were to keep our heads, as you say, if we were to keep our lives at all and possibly later do something of value, we had to pretend or on the surface accept, the orthodox religion.

But, um, huh! I'm afraid we weren't able to do as much as we had hoped. But you know, we've always been - that's one thing I've discovered - possibly the most important thing of the lot - we've always been interested in finding out truth...

Eira:
Oh yes?

Douglas:
...a religious truth.

Eira:
Good.

Douglas:
And I am not a bit surprised that I have spent so much of my time and effort, in my last incarnation, in regard to propagating Christianity.

Eira:
Yes. Yes of course...

Douglas:
My only regret is that I didn't propagate it or didn't accept what I now know to be the truth.

Eira:
Yes. That's a wonderful point darling.

Douglas:
But you and I have, for centuries, in all our incarnations, been associated and connected with religion. We have always been seekers.

Eira:
Oh. Well that's a great point isn't it? A very great point. Well I'm...

Flint:
[Loud cough]

Eira:
...so interested in that darling. You're not going to incarnate before I come over I hope?

Douglas:
No. No, I don't think I shall ever incarnate again.

Eira:
You don't?

Douglas:
I don't think you will. I think our work...our links with Earth will be finished.

Eira:
Oh yes?

Douglas:
I'm sure of that. I don't want to go back and I'm quite sure you won't.

Eira:
No. I'm not very keen...

Douglas:
I want to go ahead on this side. There's so much I want to learn and discover and find out.

Eira:
Well...

Douglas:
...and I must admit that the greatest joy here is this incessant discovery, this constant finding out and experiencing of new things. Life never ceases...uh, never ceases to be wonderful.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
There's always something fresh and new to understand and discover. I've never known such peace and calm, such placidity as I know now.

Eira:
Oh, how lovely.

Douglas:
I feel more at peace than I have ever known.

Eira:
Yes. Oh, I'm so glad.

Douglas:
And that fact that you know about this is a constant joy to me...this is the greatest blessing of all, that we have this communication.

Eira:
Yes. Thank you darling.

Douglas:
But if you want and if - I'm sure you do - in the future I will concentrate on incarnations and go into as much detail as I can.

Eira:
Yes.

Douglas:
This might make a very interesting book. I suppose I shouldn't expect you to start writing more books...

Eira:
Haha! Well...

Douglas:
Well, at least it will be of interest.

Eira:
I'm half way through another one, but as Mickey says, it will probably published posthumously!

Douglas:
It's been rather difficult today. I think it is because the medium's not well, but I...

Eira:
Oh, I think you've done very well...

Douglas:
I've done my best under the circumstances. But next time I hope we shall do much better. But, um, all my love. I must go.

Eira:
Yes. Thank you darling. It was very, very good indeed.

Douglas:
Bye-bye dear.

Mickey:
Bye-bye. It was difficult today, but I tried my utmost, rather than disappoint you. Bye-bye.

Eira:
Oh, that was kind of you Mickey.

Mickey:
God bless you. Bye.

Eira:
Bye-bye Mickey.

Flint:
Bye-bye.
I'm sure he's done his best, well quite frankly I wondered if we'd get very much today...

Eira:
Yes. It's wonderful isn't it?

Flint:
...because, um...

Eira:
Between them, they all...

END OF RECORDING

This transcript was created for the Trust by K.Jackson-Barnes - April 2nd 2018